Stricter Punishments for Minors Lying About Age

Posted 5 years, 4 months ago (Edited 5 years, 2 months ago) by ChickieDee

Edit (1/26): I want to sincerely thank the admins for the updates to the rules they have done. It makes it clear that you all truly are listening to us, and I don't think that it can be overstated enough how much this will improve both minor's and adult's experiences while using TH. Genuinely, from the bottom of my heart;

Thank you!

Hello! This is the first time that I've posted something like this, but because of various recent events on this site, I feel like this isn't something that can't NOT be brought up anymore.

My suggestion is for stricter punishments for minors on this site that lie about their age in order to evade mature content blockers that are set on this website. I have had to report two users within a span of maybe two weeks for evading the mature blockers by lying about their ages, one very openly writing fetish material with other users and with their characters while interacting with adult users and other minors. In each of these situations, the ONLY punishment that these users have faced is their account age being changed to the appropriate age.

After talking with several other users who have faced similar experiences, I felt like it was needed to send a plea to the admins to enforce stricter punishments when dealing with such users.

The Reasons Why This Needs to Be Enforced:

This behavior is ILLEGAL and puts both the users of the site AND the site itself at legal risk. Obviously the most important reason, but minors posting NSFW works or roleplaying NSFW situations with other people are considered distribution of child pornography and sexting with a minor respectively, at least in the United States. I'm not sure the exact laws concerning others countries, but considering the majority of the site in US-based, this is an EXTREME issue. It doesn't matter in the eyes of the law if the minor lied about their age; it's still illegal, and can end people up on the sexual offenders list, which can limit a person's ability to have custody of their children, where they are able to live, what sort of jobs they are able to have, etc. In short, this can effectively ruin someone's life, simply because a minor wanted to engage in NSFW works before they are legally allowed to.
This behavior effectively NULLIFIES ANY AND ALL PROTECTIONS WE HAVE ON THE SITE. It nullifies the minor block, both the hard block and the soft block, it nullifies mature character locks, it nullifies mature threads. The Maturity blocks and filters only effect those who follow the rules. It proves pointless to have when minors are bypassing via faking their ages. It's the equivalent of having a rule system at Gamestop to check ID, but then kids flash their sketchy IDs and they get a pass to get GTAV. In short, it practically renders all of these functions USELESS, because the minors who actually are honest about their ages while signing up are the only ones effected in this way by this behavior, while the offending minors get off practically scott-free.
To continue on the last point, by not further punishing these offending minors, you create a fear of other users and a fear on the site in general that this is not a safe space for adults. This has happened so frequently to the point where I legitimately go out of my way to AVOID many users who state they are minors on this website because of the actions of a few, where I have legitimately thought of removing any and all of my mature content from this site because I feel as though some minor will STILL be able to see it. There's no precedent to show that this won't be tolerated, so it will continue to happen.
By enforcing stricter punishments, it sends a clear message to minors that this sort of behavior isn't okay in any regard, and that the TOS isn't a joke.
Also, according to the TOS, this SHOULD already be a suspendable offense, as under the User Accounts section, it states that, and I quote " You agree to provide Toyhouse with accurate and complete information for registration."

Suggestion For Punishment:

Of course, this is also open for suggestions, but after talking with other users, this is the current suggestion for how to deal with this offense:

While punishment should ALWAYS be a case by case basis, the course of action when a minor is caught faking their age to bypass mature content filters should be a temporary ban of two weeks, plus the official changing of their age. Just to make it clear that this situation IS taken seriously, while still giving them the chance to acknowledge WHY what they did is wrong, and be able to grow from there

If the user is caught trying to circumvent the temporary ban OR the mature filters again by creating a new account, then a permanent IP-ban would be put in place.

Of course, this is still open to suggestions as I said, and I would love to hear feedback from other users.

In short, I feel for the safety of ALL users on this site, both adults AND minors alike, the situation of minors lying about their age to circumvent the mature content filters needs to be handled much more seriously than it has been. I love Toyhouse, and I love how broad a range of content creators we have on here, but when there is a legitimate fear to interacting with anyone or posting mature content because it isn't treated with the serious that it needs, it makes it very hard to feel safe on this site as it is.

Thank you all for reading, I hope that I've at least made a little bit of sense (as I said, I'm not very good at doing this sort of thing), and if you have anything to add, please do so!

~~ignore the IC post TH is being wei rd~~

GeckoSauce

This annoys me so much that under 18's do that but sadly it happens all the time.

As for showing ID, I think that'd put a load of people off using this site, adults too. People lying about there age happens all over in everyday life and having to show ID wouldn't necessarily fix it.

As for adults being convicted/arrested for it, I honestly think they'd look at the circumstances before hand. Authorities know themselves what the world is like these days, the online world quite literally can't be trusted.

They would be able to check that fact that they lied about their age and that you were not aware. Of course, it'd be a different story if you knew that they were under 18. If you chose to do 18+ rp or whatever with someone under 18 then that's wrong and you would be dealt with.

As for them viewing nsfw images etc, that's their own risk. If you never forced them to look at it and it was their own choice, it has nothing to do with you. If you've followed the rules and put the correct warnings on then you'll be fine.

I personally don't tend to talk to anyone younger than me because I simply don't get along with them. However, for the few I do have a decent friendship with, I'd never even think of having adult themes put towards them. If any were to even mention a subject like that I stop conversations straight away and a report would be sent.

So, users complying by the rules and putting their correct age will prevent them from seeing 18+ images etc but it wouldn't keep them from attempting to contact you etc in that way. I think it's a difficult thing to try and resolve online since so many people blatantly lie. It'd be great if something could be done but as for what, I really wouldn't know.

colorful

As someone below the legal age, I would really agree to this since this is also a heavy burden from our side since the majority of us wouldn't touch it and yeah, just our presence itself would probably make anyone over 18 feel uncomfortable. So I could give as much +1 to this as I could

The ban duration ranges, depending on the weight. Personally, fixed 2 weeks could be quite the downer but the same time, some minors know how to wait just to do whatever the heck they want once more and might take forever for them to learn. Like, students still do the same mistakes even though they get suspended for accidentally breaking the school's blackboard. I can get on why the temporary ban should be long, especially when you're above 13, the age where you should have at least basic knowledge on how to move around the internet. Then again, some minors can learn fast, so 1-2 week could probably work well, the days may change depending on their age and how the minors defend themselves. Here are some examples
- Paul recently just turned 14, and he mostly talks to people with the age range of 13-16, and sometimes 18-20. Paul may probably come from an environment with mostly minors and considering minors are wild as hell on posting whatever comes to their minds, they may think that this is the same case in here especially that there are so much similar people around Toyhouse. Paul may just be too hyper around seeing a site dedicated to OCs and thought he could be as open as he was to his previous community/environment due to the vast similarities between the active users here. Yeah, some minors are expected have the basic knowledge on why they shouldn't lie about being of legal age, though there are rare times that they just don't get why because they may think that they are mature enough to mentally tolerate all the adult content, but the comfort of adults do not cross their minds especially if they come from an environment where they only know how minors think. Maybe just give them a one week ban, since not all minors are immature enough to tolerate and understand the weight of lying about age.
- Maribel is 17, but she lies about being 18 despite being 1 year away from it, so she thinks that it's fine because she's a borderline adult. However, Maribel may either be in the same case as Paul, but considering SHE IS 17 and should probably have a better understanding than Paul, a 10 day or a 2 week ban could be given to her. There are quite a number of 17 year old minors that didn't come from the US get the reason why they are still not allowed to access 18+ content, too.
- Holger is 15, but he decided to slide in as an 18 year old because he can. With that, he approached a 25 year old Kiel's succubus OC that has heavy sexual themes for a roleplay. Toning the NSFW content of Kiel's succubus basically kills it because he knows how to handle his characters right and wants to share them with people his age. It will just kill Kiel on the inside to hide most of his characters because sharing characters was one of the things Toyhouse specializes in, and would probably discourage Kiel to go around on the site anymore due to his encounter with Holger. Holger, however, decides to throw a fit on how is this so unfair despite the warning he receives. Holger could get a 2 week or higher ban due to this.
Have a warning about stating true ages when signing up. When everyone's gonna sign up, there should be a strict warning nearby the age. Something like "Due to the laws about sharing mature content from other countries, you are advised to state your true age. Unless you are above 18, you are not advised to see and interact with the shared explicitly sexual content in the site" or something quoted better, which will give most people the impression that this is a strict rule around Toyhouse. If that is implemented, then I think that might be less troublesome and give the fixed 2 week ban more sense in the eyes of the minors. I think minors wouldn't pay too much attention on reading the ToS and Rules since again, they may think they're too 'mature' that they thought they would do whatever the heck they want unscathed.

Side note, I just think... an ID proof is bloody overkill? I get the concern but this is going to be a big no from me, as someone who also came from sites like Facebook that needs ID to prove the legitimacy of a person. I don't know, it also basically kills everything about the site since sharing that kind of information basically makes a person on the internet really fragile. Not to mention, there's a lot of people who know how to fake their IDs and yes, people younger than me (I'm 17) has faked their IDs by their own and photoshopped it, submitting it to the mods and get a pass. This is a very risky option in my opinion, this is basically just making the site shut itself down. This just feels like throwing a larger rock to those who threw a rock to you or when a fly bites you but you use a flamethrower against it. Minors getting access to adult content is a huge, privacy-breaching mistake, but young people sometimes don't learn when the same thing is done to them which makes them more angry than enlightened though

TL;DR: I think the minors who mostly do this probably don't get it due to the communities they come from

Anyways I might post more or edit my post because I'm burnt out, but I hope this also makes sense ;_;

FrankensteinLabs

Hello as a stupid kid who did this I have to say that it really does vary case by case?

When I first joined I had my age set as above 18, as I did not know the laws that could get adults on this website in trouble. Most kids are, honestly, stupid. I was stupid, my friends who did similar things without knowing why they were bad are just stupid, and uneducated.

Unless the minor is actively trying to roleplay, write, and draw nsfw with adults, it really shouldn't be anything too serious? I had a moderator contact me about my age, change it, and explain WHY it was wrong. most of the time it is that simple, but of course, there are outliers.

for instance, ive heard of minors trying to use nsfw threads and such. That should definitely be a 2-week ban with an age change, as well as an explanation as to why its such a big deal.

if the same person, say, does try to make another account to view NSFW content, something should also be done about that, again, an IP ban would probably do well.

but another thing: some adults NEED to start marking their ocs as mature content and tagging them accordingly. seriously.

even after I had the mods change my name and explain the situation to me, some of yall literally have characters for pure nsfw purposes - which is fine - but you don't mark them as mature content.

this kind of thing goes both ways.

TheMenagerie

mothgf

I think everyone found offending this rule should have a minimum 2 week ban. 2 weeks is a fair base to work off, IMO.

Mashter-Potato

How about just making it like what TH has now? You get caught, you're info is changed until you provide evidence, otherwise the NSFW is blocked? Perhaps add an IP ban for NSFW content only until they either prove their age or just actually hit their birthday?

I feel like giving a full-on IP ban of all content will hurt more people then help, either making people walk away from the site or go around the rules and try to just get their account and all their work back to what it was on another, now illegal, profile.

Not to mention, we should remember that lots of here have done it at least once, be it a video game that was for 18+ or just another website. We shouldn't just punish these people forever in a harsh way, but rather, we should just block their content until they're old enough to see it.

TL;DR: Yes to punishment, No to permanent bans.

ChickieDee

Mashter-Potato

Considering YOU were one of these minors who were blatantly tricking people into rping nsfw with you and making nsfw art for you as a minor by lying about your age, you are the kind of person we're trying to be protected from.

Also if you read the post, the permanent ban would ONLY got into place if the underage user tried to get evade their forum ban punishment.

Do not post here again.

Mashter-Potato

Alright, ChickieDee, don't try and shove me out of this, I want a coversation, not a statement and you trying to be all high and mighty.

Yes, I was one of these minors, key note on 'Was'. TH dealt with me how I would've expected: They let me know what I did was wrong, and they sorted the issue. I didn't try again, so I can't speak from experience on what happens then. But I'm 18 now, so I can go on these NSFW posts now.

I agree a ban is fair, but we shouldn't perminantly ban them either way, since they're just horny teens, with wacked out horomones. So like I said: IP ban them until they're of age, which means you don't see them again until they're 18.

Thank you for reading, if you want to continue, I shall be more then open to listen.

ChickieDee

Mashter-Potato

If they willingly and knowingly continue to break the rules after they are forum banned the first time , I don't care if they're "whacked out teens with whacked out hormones". They need a punishment; teens do not get the excuse of "being kids" for putting adults in danger and generally making them feel unsafe.

I'm going to be real with you; your case is one of the main reasons I made this post and suggestion in the first place. Every choice you made to lie about your age and interact one on one in nsfw situations with adults while under the guise of being 18 was your choice. Hormones didn't make you do that.

I get being a teen and exploring your sexuality. But lying to get into a site for pornography where you are never interacting with any adults one on one and lying to purposefully role play nsfw situations or commission nsfw art are very different. They are conscious choices, and while the argument "kids do dumb things" is true, it's not a valid reason to avoid punishment. In fact it's MORE of a reason, because it teaches them just how severe of an issue this is ( a lesson that from your posts here that you actually didn't learn mind you)

Also, speaking of high and mighty, you turned 18 a few weeks ago. You may be of legal age, but you are not magically any wiser now then you were earlier this year, your nonchalant attitude about this subject attests to this. It shows you really have learned NOTHING from the while ordeal.

zinnia

i posted here before but accidentally deleted it and i just forgot to post again but +100000000

most websites ive been on actually say on signup that you'll be suspended if you lie about age permanently and i was surprised when th was so like... relaxed about it?
i mean i've seen people on dA get banned for making jokes like 'im 9 and i see this' ... definitely not something as harsh because that's just silly but especially as the posts above me show it's an issue that needs to be addressed

aside from legal stuff it also messes with trust because th's forum community is so small x_x im still paranoid about posting in any +18 forum games or discussions because of people who've lied

Mashter-Potato

ChickieDee, Yes, I know I'm not wiser then what I was less then two weeks ago, but let's be honest: I'm trying to reason the legal side of things, not the social.

Legal says that is someone is one hour to being 18, it's illegal. If it's just over a minute of being 18, it's fine. Social is a lot more blurry and a lot more emotionally focused

Also, talking about emotional, don't you DARE say I didn't learn anything while I cried in my mother's arms while PSA after PSA was written, people literally calling me sub-human, and people who I once thought I was on good terms with slammed their doors at me. I learned that in the end, that if we look at things without context, it is obviously wrong, that one person tricked another. But if we look at context, did the 'tricked' ever make sure? No. Did the 'tricked' ever ask? No.

If you want to label me as the bad guy, do it. Just remember, nobody made sure, and I mean NOBODY.

(OH, and before I forget, I never denied punishment, I'm all for it. I'm against the idea of giving someone a chance to repeat their actions and get a heavier punishment. One punishment at one time, don't let them repeat in the first place.)