Seller Beware >>> Pvff [updated]

Posted 6 years, 1 month ago (Edited 6 years, 1 month ago) by GutsNGorey

I'm going to make this as short and sweet as possible, this is not because I have any kind of personal vendetta against this person, but because of the fact that they have repeatedly knowingly taken advantage of many people to turn a profit.

The user Pvff (same on da and chicken smoothie) blatantly ignores the TOS of any/every artist that they purchase characters from claiming that their own TOS overrides the TOS of the actual creator/s

Here is a screen shot of their current TOS as proof https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/307519314930565120/417554304312934410/Screen_Shot_2018-02-26_at_12.30.54_AM.png?width=754&height=519

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/307519314930565120/417554309300092929/Screen_Shot_2018-02-26_at_12.31.09_AM.png?width=1080&height=171

Besides this entirely inappropriate behavior they have also

- Misled an artist about the value of offsite currency in order to buy 13 characters for about $45 dollars worth (They claimed it was worth around $90) and proceeded to immediately sell these characters for $5 a piece https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/381662784368279553/417800345192890379/image.png https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/381662784368279553/417800361026387968/image.png

- Openly admitted to flipping characters without the artist's permission to resell the designs AT ALL and claiming they had permission from others to do so https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/307519314930565120/417553535270649866/Screen_Shot_2018-02-26_at_12.28.13_AM.png?width=434&height=519

- Openly reprimanded people for selling characters when they were not allowed to be sold despite claiming they're allowed to because of their TOS and doing it repeatedly https://sta.sh/01bt9iaew8ie

- Mass buys any and all characters offered to them offsite and proceeds to immediately put them uft/s on devientart http://www.chickensmoothie.com/Forum/viewtopic.php?f=69&t=3207552 https://pvff.deviantart.com/journal/9000-Characters-For-Sale-Open-731982129

- Upon being told they were not allowed to sell characters they'd obtained against the TOS of the designer deleted the characters

Basically among other shady dealings this person continually exploits people using their own "TOS" as an excuse to violate artist's/designer's and make a quick profit and when confronted attempts to delete any and all evidence that could you used to warn others.

I really hope this helps spread the word so more people don't have to have their TOS violated and their rights as an artist ignored.

Titheling

I figured I'd chime in and say given the person changed their name here it might be a good thing to update the title of this thread. There are a...lot of things happening here. I appreciate apologies and some of this seem genuine but like others said, only addressing certain aspects of this is never going to lead to anything legitimately changing. The person simply changing their username to separate themselves from the problem within a day is also pretty suspect if the situation revolves around scamming in any way shape or form...

GutsNGorey

*please do not post n this thread unless you are following the service review rules*

Titheling

@Cloverleaf I'm really not sure what that was even referring to. If you're referring to me and any superfluous text related to finding the change in username and comment about apology suspect, fine, but I also included a pretty reasonable reply here. This user looks as though they changed their username and I am referring specifically to a need to potentially change your original post to reflect that.

GutsNGorey

Milesian I was just referring to some of the people who posted previously with irrelevant things like "oh a almost got X from them" not you ^^

kroevolkture

The apology on FV tried to place blame on other people for mislabeling/selling stolen designs and that is NOT an excuse. Isolated incidents like that do not explain pvff selling for USD. I counted 3200 characters a month ago, and this whole situation forced many furvillians to have to list “don’t sell my characters to people who sell for USD” specifically because of this issue. The furvilla apology also clearly indicated that pvff was aware that people were having issues with her TOS and yet she decided to ignore it, then basically said “I don’t know how this happened.” You do know. You acknowledged your TOS being an issue in the past, so you were obviously aware that it wasn’t quite right, but you decided not to change. This is not a personal attack and I apologize if it sounds like one, im just trying to articulate my observations of your behavior, pvff.  but, you are an adult, and as an adult, you clearly had the opportunity to change and refused, and that is why this beware is here. You are the sole individual responsible for your behavior, and that is the same with everyone. 

I’m sure this will somewhat soil my reputation but I’m standing firm on this. This was highly unethical. Legal perhaps, given that exchanges were made, but using a fictional currency to purchase something only to turn around and make a real life profit off of it is purely distasteful, and I’m shocked that anyone could rationalize that being an okay thing to do. Mind you, we are not talking about accruing additional art for something, thus increasing its value.

If OP would like any links or screenshots to the FV apology or to sales threads I am willing to provide them. People have a right to know.

And I know for a fact if furvilla allowed bewares, this would have been shut down ages ago. I have actually had a conversation with another user over this, and we agreed that we felt something was wrong here. But we had no way of discussing it publicly due to the site rules. For that reason, given that this is an opportunity to expose what needed to be exposed,  I would recommend not taking this beware down. Apology or not, unless the way pvff plays the character-trade game is changed entirely, this “business” can start up again at any time under a different username, on a different account, on a different site, etc. and for that reason I think people should be aware that this happened and could happen again at any moment. 

kroevolkture

Milesian a username change also occurred on FV when people began to suspect something going on, which I believe was a month ago or so? So there have been 2 times of that happening. If pvff wants to say it was for other reasons that’s fine, but the evidence supporting that it may have been to “rebrand” should be taken into account. 

LaBelph

Funnily enough, I recalled a person with the name PishPosh here on toyhouse doing the same thing. And lo and behold:

https://toyhou.se/PishPosh


They've "moved" 🤔

I have a sneaking suspicion that this is the same person, and that it's just this starting all over again.

MiniMilkshake1001

It most likely is the same person, since it's the same "moved" icon as on her old dA. (I was wrong about not  buying from her, since I didn't realize at one point she was FloofPoof.)

Mitzbehaven

Normally I don't reply to PSAs or prefer to keep myself anonymous because it seems like a witch hunt, but I wanted to put my experiences with them in the light.

I didn't really see any issue with them during my times dealing with them, especially since the only time that I HAVE dealt with them, it was from me approaching them since they were looking for custom designs for sonas for her and her BF. I needed money, I offered, and she accepted.

We started working out the details, I tried to work quick, fixed all her problems with the pieces, and in the end, she ended up overpaying to about $50+ a custom, even paying for the edits she asked for (even though I told her she didn't have to, she insisted). I thought she was happy with the pieces, and, like I said, she's only had them since Feb. 16th.

Like I said, no issues. As an artist, I thought it was an, overall, easy experience with them.
My problems arise with the message I just got from someone here on Toyhouse by the name of Lube.
image_by_mitzbehaven-dc4klj9.png
Link to image for mobile users

Here are the two designs in the links

Their account had just been registered the 26th of this month (ironically the same day this PSA went up,) and they have 4 characters to their account currently, but all hidden. Two of them being the customs that I made for Pvff/Alleviate, you know, the ones tailored to what she wanted specifically. I asked them how much they purchased the adopts for, and they told me $10 a piece, which seems really weird that they would sell these two designs that they apparently wanted so much that they spent over $100 on total for just $20, especially since the designs suddenly went missing from my design tab here on toyhouse around the time this all started.

Look, I'm not outright saying that this account is probably the same person, but to me, it looks this way, so be wary of that incase anything weird happens with them too.
If it's not the same person, then I apologize, but everything seems a little too stacked against them right now to consider it being someone else entirely.

All together, as an artist looking for a commission, I felt they were nice and perfectly fine to deal with. As a design seller, seeing that they allegedly went for $10 less than two weeks after they spend $100 seems a little fishy, especially since you cant see the designs on the account. 

So I'm saying that, either A) If this is the same account, then steer clear. or B)If it is NOT the same account, please help me keep on the lookout for anyone other than Lube owning these designs. I'll be checking ownership transfers in anyway that I can if and when they happen to come off of hidden.