PayPal PSA(?) / Alternative Service

Posted 5 years, 1 month ago (Edited 5 years, 1 month ago) by Lukitsune

I'm not sure if this technically fits here because it's not about a particular buyer or seller BUT it is about a service that we as artists use. I think it's super important information for people to know. If this doesn't belong here I'm sure an admin will tell me and I'll remove it ^ ^

So I've had a number of people ask me why I've stopped using PayPal and started using Square so I figured I'd make a bulletin explaining my reasoning.


More and more I see cases of artists getting completely screwed over by PayPal because PayPal doesn't protect digital artists. I, unfortunately, was one of those people who got screwed over. My experience when dealing with PayPal representatives wasn't a pleasant one at all and goes as follows:

Feb. 14th- I notice that my PayPal account is limited and they wanted me to provide some legal documents to prove my identity. I gladly sent in copies of my legal documents and hoped to get the limitation removed so I could transfer my funds into my bank.

Feb. 18th- I get an email from PayPal saying that my account was permanently limited due to me apparently breaking some of their Acceptable Policy. Which I didn't mind you. It all seemed really strange as I've never gotten any charge backs or any disputes filed against me before. I was really confused as to why they would limit my account. I then check my account and it was true, I had been limited permanently. I then contacted customer support through the website and they just bs-ed me and threw the same copy, paste information that they did in their email. I then pushed more to try and find out how I possibly violated their policies. I never got a reply from them again, they just completely ignored me. 

I waited a couple hours and still no reply, at this point I was really getting worried so I called PayPal through their phone number. Once I was on the line with a representative she was very helpful but didn't seem to know what she was doing. She asked me where I sold my art and I told her, I even provided proof that customers were getting my products. She said she would fix it and get back to me within 7-10 days. 

Mar. 5th- After two weeks with no word from PayPal I decided to call customer support again. This time, the call was much shorter and much more upsetting. I told the woman about my situation and how I had waited for their call and she said, "I'm so sorry to hear that you had to wait but if you want your account unlimited you're going to have to have to take us to court." I was shocked at that, especially when the other employee said that she was fixing things. She then asked me if I wanted to know why I got limited, to which I said yes. In response in the snarkiest voice ever she said, "Then you'll have to take us to court."

I mean you don't have to like your job but I don't think you should talk to clients like that? Basically I want nothing to do with PayPal anymore.



Now for the reason that I use Square. Square (not cash) has charge back protection for all users of their system and as long as you follow their guidelines when processing your payments then you're covered up to a certain amount per month. Why are we using a service that HURTS ARTISTS. PayPal was designed around EBay for physical sales ONLY. There are better options out there with a multitude of features that makes it easier on both the artist and their clients. Square has an integration with other e-commerce services that easily allows you to fit your needs.

It works internationally, does direct depositing to your bank account, has tons of more features and services for people who provide a service. Just please take some time and take a look into the service yourself. Scams are becoming more and more common, we need to protect ourselves. If PayPal doesn't care about digital artists then we should STOP USING THEIR SERVICE!!

Edit: Thanks to Pinkaboo-Hime bringing to light something I missed, Square is somewhat international. "Card payment acceptance with the Square app is currently available in the US, Canada, Japan, Australia, and the United Kingdom. We currently don’t support payment card processing outside of these countries or in U.S. territories such as Puerto Rico, Guam, the U.S. Virgin Islands, American Samoa, and Northern Mariana Islands."


BONUS: Square is used more commonly than you think, if you've ever gone to a business and paid on an iPad then you've used it. They also own the personal fund app called Cash ($Cash app) is only for US residents the last I checked.. It's similar to PayPal's Venmo and is for personal transfers and you can't do business through it. 


Square has so many features that make invoicing and selling easy. Way easier and more comfortable than PayPal and includes even more features that can tailor the service to fit your business. Please, please try it out in the future for your own sake, we don't need to be taking the risk of charge backs and other issues just because we use PayPal.



Square's integration with lots of other e-commerce services can benefit not only digital artists but are great for merch sales too!

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Below is a test invoice to show you all how it looks from the seller's perspective. It's quite nice actually, much nicer than PayPal's. You can request tips, deposits, allow a customer to save their CC info for next time, and add an attachment of your TOS very easily.


dd1n133-436986fc-09b9-4a18-af54-eb672407



Below this is the invoice from the buyer's perspective. When you click pay in the email you are redirected to a secure web page to actually process the payment.


dd1n23y-484cf1a3-8aca-4ce4-89a0-10eb2bd2


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There's even a referral program through Square! Just as a little incentive for artists out there I'll link mine. 

squareup.com/i/LUKITSUNE0

If you wanna make an account as a seller, if you use that link you can get free payment processing! The free processing is up to $1000 and is good for 180 days.

Also that link can only be used by those in the US. Square doesn't yet support Cross-border free processing at this time.

If you have any questions I'll be happy to answer and if there's any other service that's an alternative to PayPal that's trustworthy feel free to reply here with it! Also if you've had any problems with PayPal please share your stories as well, let everyone be informed about the risk they're putting themselves in!

I don't know everything as I just started using this service so if anyone has information to correct me or to add about this service let me know as well!


EDIT: Payments accepted as of now are through debit/credit or via Google/Apple pay!

EDIT: If anyone using Stripe could give us more info on it that would be extremely helpful! As Square is not available in some countries!



L1N6L1N6

For international artists i've seen Wise as a recommendation :0 does anyone have any exp on it?
https://wise.com

DroctorGoo

Wise looks good. I will try it out.

newhorizons369

Is anyone else having issues trying to sign up with Square? I entered all my information correctly but it says they can't verify my identity. There's no option to upload documents proving it either.

L1N6L1N6

Arkansasnature as far as I'm aware of, Venmo is owned by paypal and Cashapp is owned by square. Both were originally made targeting those using payment transactions for friends/family (i.e splitting bills, e.g. for movies, dinner, rent, tickets, etc.)

I did see that Venmo started giving you a business option but my best guess is that it will be the same as using paypal since they are owned by them.

DroctorGoo

I'm searching for a good alternative too. I dunno why but PayPal seems fishy to me. T_T

unholysystemsinc

I just had a situation with PayPal where they limited my account just because I added my nickname Tabris to the note in my payment to a friend of mine for a commission and got my account restored about an hour ago after sending them screenshots to prove that it was just a nickname and not something more serious. I decided to stop using PayPal as a result and went with your suggestion of cash app and Square.

Edit: Evidence

BIRD

Sorry for reactivating this thread, and idk if this is the right place to post this, but id like to share my experience with Square myself + id love to know if other people have had the same issue? Or if people have found a way out of this?

Once i created my account and tried setting up in order to enable access to payments (like the verification process), theres this specific part of the process where they ask for your SSN. Since i NEVER share THAT type of personal information online (which i dont reccomend you do either, a SSN is one of the most important type of verification and if you get that stolen your ENTIRE identity can be taken and used for malicious puposes), and since it explicitly stated that it was optional, but that “verification process may be slower” without it (something like that), i decided not to enter it. I thought to myself that if the verification system denied me, i could just do it again. Once i completed the verification process, i was emailed saying that my application was denied, with no way of redoing it or giving an alternate form of verification afterwards. After almost an hour of searching up how to fix this, and finding a thread with people who had a similar issue, a square moderator basically told them “tough luck. Nothing we can do”, and that was that. Now im basically locked out from doing anything with my account. 

Ive heard so many good things about Square, but its a shame that their verification system is like this. I understand that valid verification is needed, but if sites like PayPal and Stripe (i think) dont NEED your social security number, and just accept other forms, then i dont see why it needs to be this way.

Kiakamill

Is kofi a good alternative? Ive heard that people doing commissions amd its even offering stuff like patreon subscription stuff o.o 

I use PayPal mainly to sometimes receive payment for adopts i resell and sometimes for payments but id like to find an alternative that won't have me worrying about unhelpful or bad customer service 

YukiUrameshi

Kiakamill Ko-fi does not process payments directly, supporters pay you directly using PayPal or Stripe.

L1N6L1N6

i found this thread on twitter about paypal alternatives; i hope this can be of use!
https://twitter.com/tsurutan_ch/status/1553321379361181696?s=20&t=8Ex_Dh86OfrJVVEFlWlVNA 

the alternatives they've listed:

  • Stripe
  • Wise/transferwise
  • Skrill
  • Payoneer
I also saw that mollie was mentioned by a user in the twt thread but there hasnt been anyone there that can share exp

Hawaiian_Pizza

Is there any good alternatives for Canadians that isn't too complicated? I can't use cashapp here and I'd like to know some good things to use

L1N6L1N6

Hawaiian_Pizza the only ones i've seen as recommendations are Wise/transferwise , Stripe and Google Wallet/Google pay